Challenge to the DotA-Community

So i played a dp2-game meanwhile my kids were resting. We lost it, it was nothing special. But afterwards this guy comes to me in IRC and saying thanks for a nice game, and thanks that i didnt get so angry and frustrated.
And ive heard this before, never really considered what people are saying. But today as i was doing some stuff here at home i realised. Its really a rough and bad atmosphere everywhere in the game of dota.
The replaysection consists of 60% comments of what people did bad, and its ofcourse not mainly nice comments. Its comments intented to make people feel bad. Think about it. What other reason could it be to say "holy shit, that windrunner sucked"

And what is the reason for making a comment like that? Does it make the commentwriter feel better, or is it in the end a hope that this windrunner will practice more?

Same things about "pro" players playing inhouseleagues (dp1, dp2). Really harsch comments if people make misstakes, or if people fails. "Fucking noob" is nothing new, and for what reason? To make the "noob" play better? Definently not, its yet again only to harm, to be offensive towards others. No other reason is good enough.
The DotA Community consists of people hating eachother. Have you seen newswriters? They are the same, if they come from different communitys the comments about the news is how they are written, or something about the pictures in the news, just to strike the other person. To make him feel bad. To make yourself feel better.

Admins of different dotaleagues. Dp2, Dotapickup, whatever. They hate eachother or atleast really dont wanna co operate with eachother, again for no real reason.
I dont know if you remember my idea about playing -RD with special draftingrules. It was written on gosugamers, again alot of people completely freaked out. I got alot of comments saying "it would never work, it would never be balanced" - those comments i appriciated. But also alot of comments saying i was stupid if i really thought it would work - just offensive words. From alot of "pro" players also. These pro players right now playing the Gosugamers cup, where the exact mode as i suggested back then is played.

Various attempts have been made to help up the manners. Often its the banprocedure. Which consists of people getting banned a number of days for saying bad words, and it helps alittlebit. But it doesnt really get to the source. I really would like to know what part of us really thinks it makes sense to call people harsch words, or to act as if you are superiour towards eachother.

Look at Kuroky after the game vs us last f4f. The game where they played techies. They had all the chance in the world to just say that "we funpicked, got owned, who cares?". But Kuro quite fast went out saying that they tried to win that game. It shows great personality and manners. This is exactly what makes the scene more interesting.
Really good players, with really good attitude.

So, im challanging you all. Professional players, noobs, midskilled, HoN players, Feeders, Gangers, call yourself whatever you want to, but try to think just a short second before you writing things or before your saying things to other players. Whats my intension? Is my intension really to just behave bad? Do i wanna feel like im a better person by saying something not really nice? Do i wish that the reciever of my comment get offended?
If thats the case - i hope someone hugs you soon.
We spend alot of time in the game - we spend alot of time together. Lets make it a time of not just fun game, but also nice attitudes and good spirit. There are alot of interesting personalitys out there too, i know because i met alot of them!
Sure its JUST the internet. But on internet we JUST have the words, so choose them wisely!

(My english is not perfect, far from, i wish i was better at it. But i know you all will understand my point)

We all need to shape up, as members of the DotA community. Sure, the internet is full of flamers where people enjoy the ability to bash other people without anything being tracked back to themselves, but it feels like DotA is suffering from this more than other eSports and it's really working against the whole scene. Teams disband because of it, people stop playing and sponsors avoid to invest in it.

2 Nebu1a:

o.O I was 'some guy.' GO ME!


3 paschl:

very nicely written, sadly it wont change anything.

oh and yeah, go nebula.

4 Pixel:

drayich, det är så sant så. Riktigt bra skrivet! keep it up!

5 Anonym:

bra sagt.

6 Anonym:

grymt sagt :D

7 HolyMaster:

soooooooooo signed ;-)

8 BrainFreeze:

9 BrainFreeze:

nice post, gotta say I totally agree with that.

people should adopt the attitude people like dray has to the game :)

10 Nukes:

Quote Drayich "Vem lärde dig att spela DotA?" =) Men det är som alltid. E-Penis e viktigare än att vinna ett game! Illa men sant.

11 koko:

You're right of course, but I think the problem lays much deeper in our XXI century (?capitalism?) internet culture.

It's not only dota. People don't respect each other, offending someone is easier due internet makes people anonymous. I bet most people won't call you "fucking shit" or "fucking useless zero" if they would see you, as a real man sitting next to you.

For instance take dota.pride league. You wait 1 month to get invited, you are not used to wait for something that long in normal life. You are impatient and ask league admin: Hey, what's up with you guys, did you read my vouch request? And they treat you worse than shit, they tell you to fuck off, and don't dare to querry me, they cancel your vouch request, and you better be more patient after 2 months. That's kind of complex of power. That waiting time is pissing off enough for me to abandon next vouch requests.

Would Pelatis say the same as you come to his home, with question about vouch request?

Asian culture is much more self critical, europeans are so far behind decent comunication. For example, check out standard public games, people say very unpleasant things, they forget dota is only a computer game.

In fact they get mad like it's more than their life, game is most important thing, and if you cannot fit their expectations, you better be prepared for swearing.

i wrote too much allready, again point for you,

P.S.be a good dad for your kids ;)

12 ggPeti:

You're absolutely right and exactly this is what I always tell to everyone who's flaming. But you're forgetting the fact that a large part of the DotA community consists of kids, immature young boys who get pissed off by everything and they're not going to think before flaming anyone. The only solution is to find the people you like to play with, who don't offend you on a whim. We should value those people and while it's a nice effort to make everyone a better person, it's absolutely impossible, so they shouldn't be bothered with.

13 HunteR_:

We'll, I know you and I are old school DotA. And it's nice to see the eSport community keeping up standards of professionalism. I see time and time again, shady people, crybabies, flamers and more. I don't expect any of the gaming community to be nice, except the professional eSports teams, why? Simply put, they need to set a standard. The others who can't do, cry, and flame. Those who are successful in games, I don't see flame.

14 udm.:

good read dray. I agree.

btw you suggested -cd? ty for that :D

15 Maklare:

Mer kramar i dota!!!

16 IGG-Csiga.hu:

Dear "old" Papa Dray, i personally tried to write this many times which u had "finally"(i use the word finally cos obviously if a someone like me writes this is a noone but ur name is more known so i hope more ppl will think about this issue) written here, to stop the harassing offending etc comments and be mannered "gentlemans" ingame so as out of the game. I tried it many times to change the attitude of hungarian players cos i think dota should develope a lot here, and it has the gamer source but not the right attitude to deal with such a growing game like dota. All the good players which i could imagine working together in one team, are hating eachother, harassing eachoter every single opportunity they find. I wrote like 10-15 similiar comment to your blogpost, ofc in hungarian and i can say i found only deaf ears, got fed up and now i just care about myself and the ppl who i work together in team. When i read ur post i was rly happy to see someone else from the pro scene also recognised this problem, and felt the intention to give voice to his toughts. Thanks for it, i hope u will get more "followers" in this besides me. And on the word "followers" i mean more mannered players on every lvl of dota. GL in THESHIT and i hope to see u soon ingame with our newly forming little noobish team ;-)

One more thing i wish to add on this post, is if someone harassed, offended, pointed out, but he/she is mannered he should not reply to that post,comment whatever, cos then he/she gets to this circle of evil from where u can never get out in a good way. Ignore the unmannered is the key of being mannered always in every case.

17 IGG-Csiga.hu:

sorry for double post, i wrote "someone else from the pro scene", i wanted to write "someone from the pro scene! im not pro. to point it out.

18 bpx:

Wise words. Just loved. ;]

I'll publish this text (with your name on it) on my blog, translated to portuguese. Really loved. Brazilian scene has too many badmanners, they have to read it.

(Is there any problem to translate and publish it around?)

19 Xealot:

Nice read and I completely agree with this opinion, Drayich. Put the dota community up for comparison with CS/CSS/WOW/SC/WC3 community and they are really pathetic. Just for self-improvement sakes, it's intention, not intension. Yea, I read the disclaimer. Cheers! All the best for upcoming games and life!

20 Drayich:

bpx, its ok if you translate it. just remember where it came from!

21 DasGnu:

Drayich for Worldpeace!!!

I fully agree. And i also agree to koko..sad world

22 Njt7:

I havent only feelt warm feelings and only positive things come out of your writings ingame. But that was a LONG time ago. I totally agree with you in every aspect if your blogg post.

But you also have to agree that sometimes that one game there is that someone geting on your nervs and you say things you actually didnt mean. Just saying its hard to co-op all the time with everyone.

Keep the smart thoughts up.


23 bATS:

I just came to think of it, when we started to play Quake 1. Well i guess that's about 13~ years ago, when we were the "scrub kids" with shitty connections playing Q1 for fun. It was the time when gamers were devided in to two groups LPBs and HPWs, and the time when the best player we knew was DragonNewbie. Even if we sucked so bad that you'd sometimes wanna scratch your own eyes out i can't recall one single flamer. Not one person with bad attitude. The "old" more experienced players would welcome you as a new player and it only took a short amount of time to become a part of the community.

I don't know how many of you guys who recall that era?

It's really all about mutual respect and empathy for one and other. Where the hardest part is remembering the time when YOU played so bad that your granny would've done it better.

agree to what you're saying mate.

P.S. I think that [L.S.D]Varg is/was the best rolemodel for online competetiv gaming. D.S.<3 :)

24 Phoenix:

Thanks for saying this out loud. I support you. :)

25 simontia:

sometime we will be angry but angry will made u lose i encounter this b4

26 Nikash:

Nice to read.

I can agree with most written here.

About mode suggestion - we've played "-CD" back in 2007 and only bad thing was that -RD had only 20 but not 24 heroes.

Still. "Admins of different dotaleagues. Dp2, Dotapickup, whatever. They hate eachother or atleast really dont wanna co operate with eachother, again for no real reason." - WTF?:)

27 Sobieski:

Dota is a game played mainly by childish young bastards without any education. That's the reason. Of course the possibility to be anonymous on the internet helps the bad behavior of most of the community. The only way to counter this is Ban 'Em All :D and give them the chance to learn good manners in the real world.


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